Posted by Todd E. (going to have to get a username soon)
One part of this talk relly stands out and I will paraphrase: "The completed work on the Cross is the only Salvation for us, if we passover this, there is nothing left for us."
We can not add to our salvation, I passed over this Salvation for most of my life, trying to attain it on my own or not trying at all. You see my concept of God was really wrong, in believing that he would never bring about wrath on a person through eternal hell. That thought would comfort me at times when I would begin to think that I could not earn my eternal life. When God reveals to us our sinfulness our eyes become wide open to how vile and deserving of his wrath we are and how just He would be in His condemnation of us. It puts us in the place like the great hymn says: "nothing in my hand I bring Simply to thy cross I cling". I also thought God could just choose to forgive me, I didn't understand the perfection that was required and that the penalty had to be paid by a man and God humbled himself in the form of man to be the 2nd Adam. It is paid in full by Jesus. I will use an illustration that is not perfect but gets part of the point; The judge left the bench and went to the execution for us.
Romans 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
Salvation is through faith alone in Christ. Thank you Jesus for taking my wrath on the Cross.
Galatians 6:14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
God is Loving and Just. Jesus, thank you for the Cross.
I'm so thankful I finally see this, Todd. Things I never understood are so clear to me now. It really does take God opening your eyes.
I am so humbled by the Cross now. I truly did not understand it when I believed the doctrine of perfection formerly taught to me. I remember thinking, "So God put His Son through all of THAT to give me nothing more than a CHANCE to overcome?" I was thankful that Jesus would do that for me even if it was only to give me a CHANCE. But it didn't make sense to me. And I lived as a Christian without hope all those years. Even the resurrection teaching was little comfort to me because I never could figure out how I could do it there if I couldn't do it here. I thought, "Well, maybe it will be so amazing to know you've resurrected from the dead that you will suddenly have the ability to be sinless." But there is no greater miracle than what Jesus has already done for us. How could it be any greater to physically resurrect than to have been spiritually resurrected from the dead? It's really hard for me to believe I ever accepted those teachings. They seem absolutely silly to me now -- not just false. When I tell friends what I used to believe, they literally look at me in such complete disbelief and amazement. I just say, "I know. It sounds really crazy, doesn't it? But that's all I was ever exposed to from birth. And I was told my whole life that we alone had these special truths."
I try to avoid using the word cult because it sounds so harsh. But I have had many people say to me, "You know you were in a cult, don't you?"
I remember being taught that Christians who didn't think they had to be perfect didn't think it mattered HOW they lived. What a horrible lie we were fed (and swallowed). When I watched that video, all I could think of was "How could anyone understand the Gospel and the Cross, consider themselves a believer in Christ, and not care how they lived in response to such a sacrifice?"
I realize there are those who are believing in the kind of cheap grace that was addressed in this video. And I consider them to be just as deceived (in the other direction) as I once was about having to earn my salvation. But I can honestly say that I have never been more convicted of sin, even minor sins, than since I have understood the true meaning of the Cross. And I don't personally know any Christians who don't think it matters how they live. Not one.
Anonymous said…
Amen Shari.
Ephesians 1 verse 14 was so important to me in refuting what I was taught that faith in Christ was not enough.
Eph 1:14 who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of {God's own} possession, to the praise of His glory.
True saving faith in Christ that is a result of regeneration by the Holy Spirit is enough and the only thing that will save.
The more I read the bible and just take what it says for what it says, it is simply amazing that I could have believed any of that. I was very much deceived and am thankful for sovereign grace. I am so thankful that he chose me when I was dead in sin, trying to medicate my condition with religion. Medicine doesn't work on a dead person. I would ask anyone that is confused by what I just said, allow God's Word to speak for itself as you read the passage below:
Ephesians 2:1 And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2 in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience. 3 Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest. 4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly {places} in Christ Jesus, 7 so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, {it is} the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
Vs. 5 points out we were dead, and the Holy Spirit regenerates us so that we are able to have the faith. The (it is) in vs 8 is referring to faith, it is the gift of God. V. 10 is pointing out our election from the Father and confirms that we will walk in good works or fruit. A true believer will have fruit, and that is not works because it was prepared by God for us to.
Read vs 6 of John chp 3 we must be born of the spirit and not flesh. Vs. 8 talks about the Holy Spirit and how we don't know where it comes from. That is why we don't choose to save ourselves, that would be flesh. No one chose to be born, no one chooses to be raised from the dead, do they? No one chooses to be born again either, it is of the Lord. John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 "Do not be amazed that I said to you, 'You must be born again.' 8 "The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."
Thank you Father for electing me, thank you Holy Spirit for drawing me and thank you Jesus for the atonement. I am a beneficiary of your Glory. All Glory goes to God.
Your last sentence has been one of the most convincing points as my eyes have been opened. What we used to believe elevates man and does not give the whole glory to God.
I remember hearing it taught that one thing which might prevent us from going on to perfection in this life was that we were not "under" a perfected ministry. But in the resurrection, the true church would be restored and the perfected ministry would be in operation. That would make the difference in our ability to overcome.
If you are still believing that, ask yourself this question: Just who does that give the glory to for our salvation/perfection? Those beliefs make the work of the ministry more essential than the work of Christ on the Cross.
Comments
One part of this talk relly stands out and I will paraphrase:
"The completed work on the Cross is the only Salvation for us, if we passover this, there is nothing left for us."
We can not add to our salvation, I passed over this Salvation for most of my life, trying to attain it on my own or not trying at all. You see my concept of God was really wrong, in believing that he would never bring about wrath on a person through eternal hell. That thought would comfort me at times when I would begin to think that I could not earn my eternal life. When God reveals to us our sinfulness our eyes become wide open to how vile and deserving of his wrath we are and how just He would be in His condemnation of us. It puts us in the place like the great hymn says: "nothing in my hand I bring
Simply to thy cross I cling". I also thought God could just choose to forgive me, I didn't understand the perfection that was required and that the penalty had to be paid by a man and God humbled himself in the form of man to be the 2nd Adam. It is paid in full by Jesus. I will use an illustration that is not perfect but gets part of the point; The judge left the bench and went to the execution for us.
Romans 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
Salvation is through faith alone in Christ. Thank you Jesus for taking my wrath on the Cross.
Galatians 6:14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
God is Loving and Just. Jesus, thank you for the Cross.
Todd E.
I am so humbled by the Cross now. I truly did not understand it when I believed the doctrine of perfection formerly taught to me. I remember thinking, "So God put His Son through all of THAT to give me nothing more than a CHANCE to overcome?" I was thankful that Jesus would do that for me even if it was only to give me a CHANCE. But it didn't make sense to me. And I lived as a Christian without hope all those years. Even the resurrection teaching was little comfort to me because I never could figure out how I could do it there if I couldn't do it here. I thought, "Well, maybe it will be so amazing to know you've resurrected from the dead that you will suddenly have the ability to be sinless." But there is no greater miracle than what Jesus has already done for us. How could it be any greater to physically resurrect than to have been spiritually resurrected from the dead? It's really hard for me to believe I ever accepted those teachings. They seem absolutely silly to me now -- not just false. When I tell friends what I used to believe, they literally look at me in such complete disbelief and amazement. I just say, "I know. It sounds really crazy, doesn't it? But that's all I was ever exposed to from birth. And I was told my whole life that we alone had these special truths."
I try to avoid using the word cult because it sounds so harsh. But I have had many people say to me, "You know you were in a cult, don't you?"
I remember being taught that Christians who didn't think they had to be perfect didn't think it mattered HOW they lived. What a horrible lie we were fed (and swallowed). When I watched that video, all I could think of was "How could anyone understand the Gospel and the Cross, consider themselves a believer in Christ, and not care how they lived in response to such a sacrifice?"
I realize there are those who are believing in the kind of cheap grace that was addressed in this video. And I consider them to be just as deceived (in the other direction) as I once was about having to earn my salvation. But I can honestly say that I have never been more convicted of sin, even minor sins, than since I have understood the true meaning of the Cross. And I don't personally know any Christians who don't think it matters how they live. Not one.
Ephesians 1 verse 14 was so important to me in refuting what I was taught that faith in Christ was not enough.
Eph 1:14 who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of {God's own} possession, to the praise of His glory.
True saving faith in Christ that is a result of regeneration by the Holy Spirit is enough and the only thing that will save.
The more I read the bible and just take what it says for what it says, it is simply amazing that I could have believed any of that. I was very much deceived and am thankful for sovereign grace. I am so thankful that he chose me when I was dead in sin, trying to medicate my condition with religion. Medicine doesn't work on a dead person. I would ask anyone that is confused by what I just said, allow God's Word to speak for itself as you read the passage below:
Ephesians 2:1 And you were dead in your trespasses and sins,
2 in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience. 3 Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest. 4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly {places} in Christ Jesus, 7 so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, {it is} the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
Vs. 5 points out we were dead, and the Holy Spirit regenerates us so that we are able to have the faith. The (it is) in vs 8 is referring to faith, it is the gift of God. V. 10 is pointing out our election from the Father and confirms that we will walk in good works or fruit. A true believer will have fruit, and that is not works because it was prepared by God for us to.
Read vs 6 of John chp 3 we must be born of the spirit and not flesh. Vs. 8 talks about the Holy Spirit and how we don't know where it comes from. That is why we don't choose to save ourselves, that would be flesh. No one chose to be born, no one chooses to be raised from the dead, do they? No one chooses to be born again either, it is of the Lord.
John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 "Do not be amazed that I said to you, 'You must be born again.' 8 "The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."
Thank you Father for electing me, thank you Holy Spirit for drawing me and thank you Jesus for the atonement. I am a beneficiary of your Glory. All Glory goes to God.
Todd E.
I remember hearing it taught that one thing which might prevent us from going on to perfection in this life was that we were not "under" a perfected ministry. But in the resurrection, the true church would be restored and the perfected ministry would be in operation. That would make the difference in our ability to overcome.
If you are still believing that, ask yourself this question: Just who does that give the glory to for our salvation/perfection? Those beliefs make the work of the ministry more essential than the work of Christ on the Cross.